Liberal Democrat Shadow Minister for Constitutional Affairs, Lord (Paul) Tyler today (Thursday) said three quarters of the British public was being denied the basic right to have an impact on the outcome of elections.

Speaking in anticipation of the Prime Minister’s speech on liberty and the Human Rights Act, Lord Tyler called on the government to publish its long-awaited review of electoral systems in the United Kingdom and told Peers:  “It is surely an absolute basic right of every British citizen to be confident that his or her vote is equal in value to that of every other citizen.  Surely in a representative democracy that is a very basic citizens’ right.”

The Minister, Lord Hunt of Kings Heath, reiterated his promise to publish the review by the end of the year but rejected proportional systems of election for the House of Commons saying he remained a “first past the post-er”.

Commenting after the exchanges, Lord Tyler said:

“The Minister showed extraordinary complacency at the effective disenfranchisement of millions of people.

“The outdated first-past-the-post system is a corrosive force at the heart of what is now a democracy in name only.  How can general elections in which only a quarter of the votes cast have any impact on the outcome be considered democratic in 2007.

“The Government has promised a Speaker’s Conference on the reform of Britain’s constitution.  This must be the issue at the very top of its agenda.  But it cannot stop there.  Every citizen of Britain is being cheated by the current system, and we must fullest public consultation on its urgent repair.

“Without reform of the way the British people are asked to elect the government of the day, trust in the whole political process is set to enter terminal decline.”

ENDS

The full exchange follows:

Lord Tyler: My Lords, I have had just a few more minutes than the noble Lord, Lord Kingsland, to examine the Statement and the consultation documents. This is as much as anything a restatement in a number of important directions but, nevertheless, my noble friends and I welcome it.

To deal with easy matters first, we very warmly welcome the decision to review the rights of democratic protest. We always thought that it was ridiculous to include in the Serious Organised Crime and Police Act 2005 an attempt to try to control the rather messy experiences that we witness daily in the middle of Parliament Square. It was not an appropriate vehicle for dealing with the very proper right of the British citizen to protest in public and close to where we hope these decisions will still be made—in the Palace of Westminster.

We must examine the issue of judicial appointments with extreme care, for the reasons that the noble Lord, Lord Kingsland, has already advanced, because in our constitution we have a rather ineffective separation of powers. The noble Lord himself has probably gone all over the world advising new democracies on the necessity of keeping separate the judiciary from the legislature and Executive. Until quite recently we had here on the Woolsack someone who was a member of the Cabinet and therefore a part of the Executive, a member of the legislature as a Member of this House, but also the supreme head of the judiciary. That was quite extraordinary. So whatever methods we are going to adopt, we shall have to look at extremely carefully.

With any sort of confirmatory hearings, surely the real confirmatory hearings should be for those responsible to Parliament. New Secretaries of State should surely come before either Joint Committees or Select Committees of the other House.

As the Statement has made clear, there are 12 areas in which the royal prerogative could be re-examined—and only a few are dealt with in the process in front of us today. There is no reference to the dissolution of Parliament, which may in the light of recent events be rather more significant and urgent than the issues that are in the Statement. It would be extraordinary if the Government so lost their majority in the Commons that they could not carry the day on that issue—and, if they can carry the day, the only effect in terms of real change to the balance of power in this country would be a further restriction on the monarch, who in certain circumstances can potentially still have a view on that matter.

On the war-making powers and treaty ratification, we look forward to hearing the Government’s proposals for your Lordships’ House. We believe that in both cases there is a role for us in this place, as well as the other place; but we are very strongly in favour of placing the issue of treaty ratification on a statutory basis. We do not believe that an informal convention is sufficient.

In the Statement there is also a welcome change in the Government’s attitude on the issue of requests for freedom of information. We very warmly welcome the decision to review that; we thought that it was anti-democratic that the charging regime should have been ratcheted up on the basis of previous proposals. We also welcome the decision to look again at how the resources of the National Audit Office could be made available to both Houses.

The future of the Human Rights Act is only very briefly mentioned at the end of the Statement but we understand that it will be the subject of a rather fuller explanation of the Government’s policy from the Prime Minister outwith Parliament today. We believe that the Act needs strengthening, not weakening, and we shall examine that very carefully.

What are not in the Statement but are in the Green Paper are matters that we believe are equally urgent to those that are contained in it. Nothing more need be said about House of Lords reform at the moment—but one hopes that in the next couple of weeks we will hear more. The concordat referred to in The Governance of Britain Green Paper between central and local government is a really urgent issue and nothing has been said about it. Members of your Lordships’ House will recall that on all sides and in all parties the relationship between central and local government is considered to be at a critical stage, and this concordat will be very important.

At the time of the Green Paper much reference was made to a proposed Speaker’s Conference. What is the remit for that conference? What will be the representation in that conference, and what is the intended timescale? The noble Lord, Lord Kingsland, said that our constitution does not need renewing. These Benches believe that it certainly does, and for one very important reason. It is surely an absolute basic right of every British citizen to be confident that his or her vote is equal in value to that of every other citizen. Surely in a representative democracy that is a very basic citizen’s right. Given that there is now wide recognition that three-quarters of the electorate have no impact on the outcome, and their vote is therefore wasted, when will Ministers release their internal departmental examination of voting systems? We have long been promised the report. It was referenced in the Green Paper in paragraph 156 that it was imminent and should be with us before the end of the year. The end of the year is coming very swiftly. When will the Government accept that this gross distortion at the heart of the democratic governance of Britain should at least be referred to the Speaker’s Conference and to a general wider consultation among the public? Otherwise at the very heart of the Government’s proposals there is an aching void.

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12.51 pm

Lord Hunt of Kings Heath: My Lords, I am grateful to both noble Lords for their comments. Given that he was not able to read the documents, the noble Lord, Lord Kingsland, did very well indeed. I would have no hesitation hiring him as my lawyer if ever the need arose.

Of course, I understand that the documents that were released alongside the Statement are weighty and need and deserve great care and consideration by your Lordships, the other place and members of the public. We very much welcome the contribution of all noble Lords to the debate. These are very much consultation documents. Many of the recommendations are not firm; they are ideas, suggestions and options. I am sure that we shall all have an opportunity to debate them much more fully over the coming weeks and months.

The noble Lord, Lord Kingsland, referred to one of the most important papers in many ways—that concerning war powers. I agree with him that the provision of information to Parliament when it is called on to make such a weighty decision is absolutely critical. I accept that there will always be a balance to be drawn between the needs of security and sometimes diplomacy and the need to give as full information as possible to parliamentarians. Those matters are rehearsed—

Lord Renton of Mount Harry: My Lords—

Lord Hunt of Kings Heath: My Lords, I shall respond to the Front Benches first and then we have 20 minutes for other noble Lords to make their points.

The consultation paper looks at the very issues that the noble Lord, Lord Kingsland, raises. It also suggests that an appropriate Joint Committee of both Houses might consider some of the more sensitive information. However, I have no hesitation in saying to him that this is a matter to which we must give very great attention.

The noble Lord, Lord Kingsland, made other extremely important points. As regards treaty ratification, often a long time may elapse between original discussions and actual ratification. It is important that parliamentarians are able to debate the principles at the beginning of the process as well as ratification of the treaty at the end. Ratification is very much at the end of the process. It has been the practice of successive Governments to make changes in domestic legislation to ensure that they comply with the treaty before the ratification process is brought to Parliament. My experience of treaties that I have been involved in relating to health and children is that there have been many opportunities for noble Lords and Members in the other place to debate these matters.

The noble Lord, Lord Kingsland, referred to judicial appointments and we again discussed the issue that we debated during proceedings on the Legal Services Bill. I echo what he said about the importance of the independence of the judiciary. The consultative paper presents a number of options for reducing the role of the Executive in the judicial appointments system; for example, the ability of the Lord Chancellor to reject a selection by the Judicial Appointments Commission could be reduced. The ability of the Lord Chancellor to require the Judicial Appointments Commission to reconsider could be reduced or removed. The Lord Chancellor’s role could be reduced to a largely formal one, although he could question the process used by the Judicial Appointments Commission. There could be a complete surrender of the Executive’s role with responsibility transferred to, for example, the Judicial Appointments Commission. Those are all options that will fall to be considered.

The noble Lord, Lord Kingsland, raised a very interesting point about the role of Parliament. In the consultative paper the Government say that they have serious doubts about pre-employment hearings as a way to identify the best candidates on merit. They are concerned about the risk of politicisation in that process. They have concerns about non-binding hearings before confirmation but after the appointments process for the same reason. They go on to say that some form of hearing might be more suitable for very senior judges, not in the context of what are described as post-appointment hearings but more to allow those senior judiciary appointments to discuss issues in relation to the administration of justice. I am very happy to take on board the comments of the noble Lord, Lord Kingsland, on this, and I am sure that he will want to contribute further.

I am grateful for the welcome that the noble Lord, Lord Tyler, gave to some aspects of the papers. He is right to stress that extreme care must be taken with judicial appointments. I hope that he will read the paper with great interest. I look forward to debating it with him. As regards confirmatory hearings, I am not sure that I completely agree with his remarks about a new Secretary of State, and I am not sure that I would want that extended to your Lordships’ House for rather more junior Members of the Government. But clearly the Government have signalled that they are interested in the principle of hearings by appropriate Select Committees for certain very important public offices, and we will pursue that matter. I welcome his comments on freedom of information. Again, much effort will be made to engage noble Lords and Members of the other place in that matter.

As regards House of Lords reform, in the light of the vote taken by the House of Commons and the work of the joint group, my right honourable friend the Prime Minister said at the Labour Party conference that the next Labour Government manifesto—whenever that is produced—would contain a commitment to the principle of election. There is much to be discussed between now and then and I look forward to all noble Lords taking part in those discussions and informing the work of the joint group.

The new Local Government Bill, which your Lordships’ House debated recently, and the concordat indicate that a much more grown-up relationship is developing between central and local government. The terms of reference and the timing for the Speaker’s Conference are being discussed at the moment. I cannot tell noble Lords any more than that, but the details will be published shortly.

On the voting system report, I am still sticking to the end of the year; we have some way to go. As far as what the noble Lord called “representative democracy” is concerned—he meant proportional representation and the political fortunes of the Liberal Democrat party—I remain a first past the post-er. Again, certainly in relation to discussions on reform of your Lordships’ House, I have no doubt that we will have every opportunity to discuss these matters very fully.